Curse

Trance Addict · Nov 11, 2005, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Quote:

now my nuker 4 life that got 700k xp by nuking is a spiker which is pretty useless in pve

Pretty useless in PvE? They do more damage (AP ftw) and are now single targets. Instead of having 3 nukers throwing off AoE, now, you'll have 3 spikers, each one killing his own target. What's wrong with that?

lg5000 · Nov 11, 2005, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trance Addict

"It's sad. [Followed by] Why would my feelings be hurt?"

Read what you type. You're taking this like it's the end of the world. Be happy that people won't rely so much on Fire Eles and that other Elements and Professions will be accepted in groups.

Hm... I've got a water ele who I got to thunderhead keep before being very bored with her.. I've had no problems finding groups and have always advertised what I was playing.

I also have a mesmer who has had no problem finding groups (unless it's skill capping or the time of day where only 6 people are online).

People are taking other professions into their groups these days, nerving that many skills isn't going to do anything, other than make people upset.

BlackOut777 · Nov 11, 2005, 02:59 PM // 14:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalypse_xx

Hello everyone, after reading all the posts and giving
this last update some serious thought I wanted to share
my feelings and I think that many people who play GW
like myself may be feeling the same things. First of
all, I have been playing GW since it's public release on
April 28th and have accumulated several million exp
points on 2 different charcters. These 2 characters
completed the game 100%, every mission, every bonus,
every quest and I enjoyed it immensely. After that, I
enjoyed very much seeking out rare and perfect weapons,
my fissure armor, my 1000p in storage, I really enjoy
the thrill in treasure hunting, my favorite axe is a
6-20 tribal, or my 6-20 sickle, I love rare and/or
awesome looking items. But now, with all of these
things accomplished, I find myself looking for more, I
used to love solo ing the UW, just because to me it was
fun wondering what rare drop I might get, even the
previous solo nerfs were very much welcomed by me since
I had to re-invent how I solo, btw, I can still solo
everywhere that I could before this last update, even
the UW, only, it takes me a tiny bit longer, no big
deal, but what this last update did confirm to me is
that I had been fooling myself, this game is about
teamwork, it is not meant to be played the way I enjoyed
playing it, I don't like pvp, never have, I do however
like the community and co-op missions, but they only
last for so long, I thought the Halloween event was
amazing, I found myself laughing out loud on several
occasions, but this is not enough, and sadly I realize
that even chapter 2 will not fufill what it is I am
looking for, I want to search for rare items, I want to
log in and quickly treasure hunt by myself sometimes,
but this is not what GW is all about and the devs told
us that right from the beginning, so here is point, I am
not bashing GW at all, I very much got my money's worth
from the game, it is an awesome game, however, like
myself, perhaps some other players need to examine what
it is that they need from a game, and if their needs are
like mine, then maybe GW is not for us...after all, it was
never intended to be. So, I truly hope GW will remain
strong and the players will remain happy, thank you for
reading and thanks for the fun 6 months

First of all let me start off by saying that I am a fairly casual player and like some of you have expressed I don't play it 24/7 and don't have the time to experiment with different builds all the time. Having said that.

I agree with the above quote - that GW was meant to be all teamwork/team play style game and yes ppl found ways around it with different style builds and have been soloing it. Also agree with him on the fact that I'd like to get on and go treasure hunting - and since I started very late in the game to do solo stuff (after skill nerf which changed BA and ZF) so I am NOT rich and don't have killer stuff. I have hooked up with a few ppl and traded items for them for a comission/tip cause I love doing trades.

So this update affects me directly as from a casual players prospective it definitely makes it more difficult to just go out there and "do" it all by yourself. But then again - GW was not meant to be played that way.

I want to say that not all is negative - as I truly love this game. I came for the Diablo 2 world and I have REALLY enjoyed playing GW but after this update things are going to be little more difficult.

Key thing to do is ADAPT to the change - I am sure they will not "UNDO" the change so we can rant and rave and finally go back and put our thinking caps on come up with a few different builds and maybe a bit more co-operative play. On the note of playing in groups - I am not a part of any guild as it seems that the last 3 or 4 guilds I have joined have been basically run by 13 year olds (please let me finish before you guys FLAME ME!) who get all high and mighty and nobody really wants to help out. NOW I AM SURE that was my string of bad luck of getting into guilds with leaders/members with ego problems and it is NOT meant against everybody. So I am hoping with this change maybe a few more friendly ppl getting together and playing in teams and helping each other out. (let's see how badly I get flamed for this!)

Last but not the least - how will this effect the economy. I think there are 3 lvls of players out there (IMHO) - the super duper uber rich folks who are fanatics who play the HECK out of the game! The mid rangers who are like ppl like me who have a few good items and maybe 100K or so and play/trade regularly but not excessively and spend money practically (Droks armor as opposed to 15K and stuff). And last but not the least ppl who are starting off and don't have a lot of funds and trying to make it. NOW with this change it will probably spike the cost of the uber items through the roof which will make the mid guys and the low end guys just hate life as things will cost an arm, a leg, and your left nut!

As far me, I'll keep at it for the next few weeks and see how things work out.

I aslo wonder how this will effect the sales of Chapter 2 - considering this update has caused so much uproar.

Anyways - those are some of my random thoughts and my 2 cents!!

Ok guys - I guess FLAME ON!

aron searle · Nov 11, 2005, 02:59 PM // 14:59

If Anet want to stop UW farming.

Why not make it so you need at least 5 people to enter UW.

all the skills that have been made usless by this and other "updates", and to be honest.

Why have FOW armour when the only realistic way for most poeple to buy it is to UW farm.

makes no sense whatsever

Mysterial · Nov 11, 2005, 02:59 PM // 14:59

This thread is getting crazy, so a few last points:

-While I like the update in general, running from Fireball is a little overkill. Especially since if you cast it while they're casting, they'll often end up running AFTER they get hit.

-I still haven't heard any arguments to my point that if nuking now sucks the solution isn't to make the AI stupid again, it's to make those skills not suck.

-How hard is it to switch out a single nuke spell for a snare so they can't escape? How does that ruin your build? Some of them, like Deep Freeze, don't even require attributes for the snare part.

Trance Addict · Nov 11, 2005, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Hm... I've got a water ele who I got to thunderhead keep before being very bored with her.. I've had no problems finding groups and have always advertised what I was playing.

I also have a mesmer who has had no problem finding groups (unless it's skill capping or the time of day where only 6 people are online).

People are taking other professions into their groups these days, nerving that many skills isn't going to do anything, other than make people upset.

Compare one group taking in a off-character to all of those running the Monk/Warrior/Nuker (and perhaps battery) build? The ratio is somewhere along the lines of 10:1.

id0l · Nov 11, 2005, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trance Addict

"It's sad. [Followed by] Why would my feelings be hurt?"

Read what you type. You're taking this like it's the end of the world. Be happy that people won't rely so much on Fire Eles and that other Elements and Professions will be accepted in groups.

Obviously you couldn't comprehend whom I was talking to when I saying "Why would my feelings be hurt?" (obviously talking to Former Ruling, since I quoted him). It had nothing to do with the comment "It's sad," which is regarding the state of the AoE skills in the game right now in PvE.

Why don't you read what I type?

kade · Nov 11, 2005, 03:01 PM // 15:01

Just hopped in and tested out the new update, and while I'm not particularly happy with it I don't plan on leaving the game. I have been playing mmo's for quite some time now and I have come to expect nerfs....even extremely harsh ones to characters I have invested hundreds of hours into. This certainly doesn't warrant an unnecessary and senseless nerf by any stretch of the imagination. However, if I enjoy a game enough to invest in it such a large amount of time and money, it will take more than a single nerf - even several nerfs - to ruin it for me.
All this is to say that I sincerely hope that all of the players such as myself stick around and continue creating an entertaining community which I have enjoyed from the beginning. For those who decide not to I hope to see you in my future mmo adventures. Though hopefully anyone who has enjoyed a game enough to spend a thousand plus hours in it will give a release (no matter how outrageous) more than 24hours chance

lg5000 · Nov 11, 2005, 03:02 PM // 15:02

No, not just one group.. multiple groups. this far into the game, people have played more than just those professions and can see where the benefits of other professions can come in.

And the update isn't going to magically change people's opinions of what to take, more than likely, they'll take more warriors

Don't I feel sorry for the monk having to heal that many warriors.

Trance Addict · Nov 11, 2005, 03:03 PM // 15:03

Quote:

which is regarding the state of the AoE skills in the game right now in PvE.

Why? Because like people, now they get OUT of AoE? Why not just make all of the enemy NPCs do 0 damage and take 300000% damage from all sources while you're at it. They're increasing the difficulty of the game. If it gets too rough for you, maybe you should stop playing GW and go back to trying to pass kindergarden.

Kalt · Nov 11, 2005, 03:04 PM // 15:04

This update sucks.

Thunderhead keep is now even harder with the enemies running in and out the keep while another group is storming in from the other gate.

Now the nuker ele will have the same faith as the mesmer in temple of ages.

If it bothers farmers bother Anet so much then stop making everything so expensive. How are players suppose to buy a 15k armor and other expensive stuff? By selling cookies to the dwarves?

Maybe they should focus on making more fun instead of making the game even worse. You know like inventing new monster, new weapons new quests.

Loralai · Nov 11, 2005, 03:06 PM // 15:06

Here's an interesting take on economic effects. Superior elemental runes of air, water and earth are no longer available at traders. Scalpers have bought them all and are now selling them at 10-20k, (what they more than likely purchased for 700g). Nice...

BlackOut777 · Nov 11, 2005, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalt

This update sucks.

If it bothers farmers bother Anet so much then stop making everything so expensive. How are players suppose to buy a 15k armor and other expensive stuff? By selling cookies to the dwarves?

Maybe they should focus on making more fun instead of making the game even worse. You know like inventing new monster, new weapons new quests.

There are COOKIES I can sell to dwarves - Where can I farm for cookies - ahem, I mean - find cookies, or rather bake them!!

You my friend have hit the nail on the head!

I want the game to be FUN and not WORK!

apocalypse_xx · Nov 11, 2005, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackOut777

So this update affects me directly as from a casual players prospective it definitely makes it more difficult to just go out there and "do" it all by yourself. But then again - GW was not meant to be played that way.

Very well put, and it is only now that I admit it to myself that I will find happiness, people please understand, this update did not kill solo play, it is merely a very loud message that solo play is not welcome in GW, it is just a shame that they have to mess with skills in order to try and achieve their goals

Trance Addict · Nov 11, 2005, 03:08 PM // 15:08

Quote:

Here's an interesting take on economic effects. Superior elemental runes of air, water and earth are no longer available at traders. Scalpers have bought them all and are now selling them at 10-20k, (what they more than likely purchased for 700g). Nice...

Nice indeed. I have a Flame's Eye with a Superior Fire rune, Stone's Eyes with a superior Earth and so on. And all collectors staff with +30 health and +5 armor ^_^

Blu Vein · Nov 11, 2005, 03:16 PM // 15:16

Now, I understand diversity in PUGs and I try to create that when I go out with groups. However this update put a serious nerf on any AoE spells. Ofcourse the main fire line are all AoE spells. So that whole line in PVE is junk like it is in PVP. Now I feel that was a bit uncalled for as I understand from time to time various skills get nerfed for balance this nerfed an ENTIRE line of skills. There are some people out there such as myself that had a nuker that wasn't designed from cookie cutter builds but by experience.

As far as my damage yes it was great but there are other builds that cause just as much damage from other classes. It is just disappointing when you spend time to made a build of your own that gets totally nerfed. Now I have to spend hours finding a different skill combination and getting used to how to use it effectively.

My only point here is that how long must this go on ANET nerfing builds? Anytime a great build gets made they nerf it seems. How would they like it if we were able to nerf some of their Developer team builds. So the question is should I even waste my time with this game and figuring out a new build if they are simply going to keep nerf it to?

jibikao · Nov 11, 2005, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kool Pajamas

I dont really like the monsters not chasing fleeing players. Seems to make it too easy.

I like the monsters fleeing from AoE spells. Maybe Fire Eles wont be the only type in PvE now.

Thank god. What's more importantly, it reduces the number of the so-called "tank" W/Mo.

Instead of tanking, maybe it's a good idea to utilize Ranger/Necro/Mesmer's ability? Interruption, Condition, Hex.

Say goodbye to those "tank, nuker, healer" day!! (I hope)

Adambomb · Nov 11, 2005, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Since starting college I haven't had the time to play GW as much as I did through the summer, which was practically all the time I wasn't eating or sleeping. I've now become a 'casual' gamer and play it for maybe two or three hours a night after I've done my homework and walked the dog etc.

I can't really do that anymore... well I can but its so damn tedious. I have a trapper ranger for UW who is now pretty much worthless - I've noticed in ToA there aren't that many people making parties consisting of trapper rangers. And going sniper / barrage bot / interrupter in UW is pointless.

My other character, a Wammo has been screwed because people don't want W/Mo anymore.. I'm a tank and am not that bad at it but people don't want warriors anymore...

I farm a bit... usually Griffons at Augury and when I did it was because I was bored or I wanted to make a lil bit more dinero. I'm now screwed with that as well.

I'm gonna stop playing GW for a little while and see what happens. If nothing changes [i.e the whole AoE thing] then I might just quit GW altogether because as I see it, with this new update PvE finishes as soon as you complete the story mode. UW, FoW and to some degree, faming are cool things to do after you've completed the story aspect and are looking for stuff to do. All of these have been nerfed into oblivion because all the builds what were damned successful when entering UW, FoW or farming have been castrated with a pair of dirty, great pliers - basically other builds like sword damage dealers or sniper rangers etc are only good if you're going through the story missions and quests or PvP which I haven't really played much of before.

Prices with some things are gonna skyrocket now likle ecto's because getting them from UW has gone from damned hard to exceptionally, insanely almost impossible. People (especially W/Mo farmers) who have a bulging purse will have an economic advantage over everyone else. Its like the Green Revolution in India and other countries in the 1960's. The rich got richer, and the poor stayed damn poorer.

-Adam

id0l · Nov 11, 2005, 03:23 PM // 15:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trance Addict

Why? Because like people, now they get OUT of AoE? Why not just make all of the enemy NPCs do 0 damage and take 300000% damage from all sources while you're at it. They're increasing the difficulty of the game. If it gets too rough for you, maybe you should stop playing GW and go back to trying to pass kindergarden.

What's with the insults? Are you getting defensive because more people are against this trash update than on your side? I highly doubt post-patch anything will be difficult, so I don't see your point in that statement. Spam AoE FTW. Try to lay off the lame personal insults, because you only make yourself look like a little incompetent kid. Little incompetent kids resort to popping off insults instead of explaining their reasoning with a bit of intelligence.

The AoE is garbage right now because of a couple reasons. And I'm talking mainly DoT AoE.

1. It's meant for damage, mainly. Not dealing much damage when the enemy runs away. Might as well call Fire Storm "Gust of Wind Storm", because all it does it push the enemies away from where it's cast. Should call Ignite Arrows "Ass Arrows" because when you hit the enemy with it all you see is their ass as they're fleeing in fear.
2. People exploiting damage dealing AoE to "instill fear" into mobs already.
3. Forcing people to take certain skills (or whole other person) i.e. snares, slow spells, etc., to make AoE even a feasible option.

I could go on but it's not even worth it right now...I'm done explaining the inherent faults of this update, it's pretty obvious on it's own after only a little bit of playing.

Darkest Dawn · Nov 11, 2005, 03:24 PM // 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

That's exactly what I was thinking when I read the Update Notes as few days ago. How many times have you guys gotten mad at the Henchies? And haven't you felt just a tiny bit cheesy when you cast an AoE Spell like Fire Storm, knowing it that the monsters were going to stand there like lumps, taking it until they died?

"Hey, there, my Charr buddy, did you notice your fur was flaming and your teeth were melting?"

"Why yes, my stalwart comrade, I did note that uncomfortable fact. But you know, I'm just too dense to up and move my furry behind out of this torrential downpour of spells. I think I'll just stay here and expire."

How fun is it? Sort of like taking candy from a baby, isn't it? I never wanted to feel sorry for my enemies; I just wanted to feel powerful when I smited them. So if the monster enemies are actually more on par with a real player, isn't that a good thing? Doesn't that make accomplishments more meaningful?

And for those who are concerned (I won't say "whining" but others have

) about farming, why in Dwayna's name do you think you should be able to solo some of the highest level areas to farm? How realistic is that expectation? I mean, if you could in the past -- and if that wasn't intended or balanced -- does that mean it should be left for players to do so indefinitely? No criticism for farmers, not at all. But in a game built on strategy and teamwork, like Guild Wars, it simply doesn't seem to me that it's reasonable to ask to play the highest end content as a solo player.

In the end, though, my opinions aside, we tested these changes for some time and the consensus was that they were reasonable and fair. We are most definitely listening to all your feedback and will certainly be willing to consider future changes in the interest of game improvement.

Gaile,

Hi! What can we do about the henchie elementalists(Cynn, and Orion) who use AOE skills like firestorm? Can we add some more diversity to their skill list since they will scatter mobs whenever they cast the AOE spells?